New K8200 owner!

[ichbinsnur]

I had similar problems at first.

I worked out that the hobbed bolt used in the extruder is quite “round” so i “sharpened” (cut deeper) the teeth a little with my dremel.
That helped a lot. Also the spring must’t be overtightened, (7.10 half turns sound good)

In general the E3D needs a little more temperature than the stock hotend, due to it’s smaller melting zone.
About 10-30 °c more, depending on the filament.

The retraction value also sounds good. i use 0.6mm for PLA and ABS and about 3mm for Ninjaflex.

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”]I had similar problems at first.

I worked out that the hobbed bolt used in the extruder is quite “round” so i “sharpened” (cut deeper) the teeth a little with my dremel.
That helped a lot. Also the spring must’t be overtightened, (7.10 half turns sound good)

In general the E3D needs a little more temperature than the stock hotend, due to it’s smaller melting zone.
About 10-30 °c more, depending on the filament.

The retraction value also sounds good. i use 0.6mm for PLA and ABS and about 3mm for Ninjaflex.[/quote]

Cool, I since have got the print bed temp relay setup going, then failed
The relay I used couldn’t support that frequency of on/off’s. I ordered a bifurcated relay based on my brother’s recommendation as an electrical engineer. I haven’t received just yet, but hope it’ll carry the load and frequency of on/off’s when keeping the bed temp stable.
I’ll also try the sharpening like you said. I ordered e3d’s hobbed bolt and while super nice teeth, it is too short to fit stock 8200 extruder width.

Here’s what I’m waiting for now, http://www.newark.com/te-connectivity/rt31c012/relay-spst-c-o-12v-16a-bifurcated/dp/51R7375
to still get some heat to the bed so I can print your nice e3d mount w/ninjaflex extension in ABS so I don’t melt it by accident as I’ve done with others tried.

Getting there, definitely alot of “common sense” to find some solutions along the way!

Have you installed the K8204 Z axis upgrade? I did because I’m going to also reconstruct the unstable z homing with some other things I have. Just curious how people like that upgrade. I’ll poke around and see.

Do you have any other 3D printers? Needless to say, this is an addictive “hobby”!!

[ichbinsnur]

@Meximelt

Cool, I since have got the print bed temp relay setup going, then failed
The relay I used couldn’t support that frequency of on/off’s. I ordered a bifurcated relay based on my brother’s recommendation as an electrical engineer. I haven’t received just yet, but hope it’ll carry the load and frequency of on/off’s when keeping the bed temp stable.
I’ll also try the sharpening like you said. I ordered e3d’s hobbed bolt and while super nice teeth, it is too short to fit stock 8200 extruder width.

Here’s what I’m waiting for now, http://www.newark.com/te-connectivity/rt31c012/relay-spst-c-o-12v-16a-bifurcated/dp/51R7375
to still get some heat to the bed so I can print your nice e3d mount w/ninjaflex extension in ABS so I don’t melt it by accident as I’ve done with others tried.

The relay looks good. Seems the same brand as mine (salvaged from an automation PCB), only your’s is capable of more current.
How often does it switch? My heatbed toggles only at 20-30 second intervals.

[quote]Have you installed the K8204 Z axis upgrade? I did because I’m going to also reconstruct the unstable z homing with some other things I have. Just curious how people like that upgrade. I’ll poke around and see.
[/quote]

Indeed i have, and it works quite nice, especially after my “hanging” mod. → Hanging Z axis mount for Velleman K8200/3drag with velleman K8204 Trapezoid leadscrew upgrade by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse

I just finished to equip ,my z axis with a second one, to give it more strength. → K8200 (3drag) dual leadscrew z axis upgrade with 2 Velleman K8204 leadscrew Kits by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse
Or look here : viewtopic.php?f=53&t=15651

Do you have any other 3D printers? Needless to say, this is an addictive “hobby”!!

Yes, it sure is! And, no, not by now. But i’m planning on designing my own, which should have some features not really available on the market right now.
At least, if any, not affordable. I also thought about getting a Vertex, but currently i have too less time and too less spare money.

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”][quote=“Meximelt”]
Cool, I since have got the print bed temp relay setup going, then failed
The relay I used couldn’t support that frequency of on/off’s. I ordered a bifurcated relay based on my brother’s recommendation as an electrical engineer. I haven’t received just yet, but hope it’ll carry the load and frequency of on/off’s when keeping the bed temp stable.
I’ll also try the sharpening like you said. I ordered e3d’s hobbed bolt and while super nice teeth, it is too short to fit stock 8200 extruder width.

Here’s what I’m waiting for now, http://www.newark.com/te-connectivity/rt31c012/relay-spst-c-o-12v-16a-bifurcated/dp/51R7375
to still get some heat to the bed so I can print your nice e3d mount w/ninjaflex extension in ABS so I don’t melt it by accident as I’ve done with others tried.
[/quote]

The relay looks good. Seems the same brand as mine (salvaged from an automation PCB), only your’s is capable of more current.
How often does it switch? My heatbed toggles only at 20-30 second intervals.

[quote]Have you installed the K8204 Z axis upgrade? I did because I’m going to also reconstruct the unstable z homing with some other things I have. Just curious how people like that upgrade. I’ll poke around and see.
[/quote]

Indeed i have, and it works quite nice, especially after my “hanging” mod. → Hanging Z axis mount for Velleman K8200/3drag with velleman K8204 Trapezoid leadscrew upgrade by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse

I just finished to equip ,my z axis with a second one, to give it more strength. → K8200 (3drag) dual leadscrew z axis upgrade with 2 Velleman K8204 leadscrew Kits by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse
Or look here : viewtopic.php?f=53&t=15651

Do you have any other 3D printers? Needless to say, this is an addictive “hobby”!!

Yes, it sure is! And, no, not by now. But i’m planning on designing my own, which should have some features not really available on the market right now.
At least, if any, not affordable. I also thought about getting a Vertex, but currently i have too less time and too less spare money. ;)[/quote]

OK - So I’m confident on the relay…when it finally shows up from the UK.
- Regarding the frequency of switching, I only had it working for a day or so before it killed my relay contacts. I feel as if it was more on the 5-10 sec between on/off’s but will have to see once I get that going again
- did you have a socket for your relay for the heatbed or directly solder to the contacts?

Your “hanging mod” is really cool and I’d love to try that → Hanging Z axis mount for Velleman K8200/3drag with velleman K8204 Trapezoid leadscrew upgrade by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse
- Do you print all of your parts in ABS for the machine mods or PLA depending on where used?

I also would love to try your 2nd mount for the z axis and like the idea much better than ones running dual steppers which is not necessary

I have looked at the vertex in passing and think it’s a pretty cool machine. But with this machine, I feel as it is really truly “limitless” to the upgrades that can be done!

I have been playing with a 0.8mm nozzle on the std. e3dV6 - got a couple successful prints but for prints that start with a couple “islands” say, corners off the bed, part way up start to curl up. From there I encounter the nozzle hitting after single layer height increase (unless it starts where it just finished, but will still slam into the next “island”.
- I’m still sticking with simplify3d as I feel comfortable with it now and like the custom options with the supports, etc.
- Do you know of what may be causing my warped up corners? I am thinking I need to bring the outlines to single and only one bottom layer.
- I feel as if someone told me that there is a way to raise then lower back when going to the next point so it doesn’t lose x / y location.
- Let me know how you handle such prints in general, where it’s not a bed adhesion issue but warping “curling up” on the say 4th layer.

I greatly appreciate all of your help and answers with your experience behind them! Look forward to hearing from you and hopefully helping others who read these posts along the way

[ichbinsnur]

@Meximelt

OK - So I’m confident on the relay…when it finally shows up from the UK.
- Regarding the frequency of switching, I only had it working for a day or so before it killed my relay contacts. I feel as if it was more on the 5-10 sec between on/off’s but will have to see once I get that going again
- did you have a socket for your relay for the heatbed or directly solder to the contacts?

I just soldered the relay and the components on a small piece of striped perf-board and made a small case for it.

Can it be it’s not the contacs that are gon on your relay, but the coil?
Did you use a proper current limiting resistor and a flyback diode when you connected the coil?

Your “hanging mod” is really cool and I’d love to try that → Hanging Z axis mount for Velleman K8200/3drag with velleman K8204 Trapezoid leadscrew upgrade by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse
- Do you print all of your parts in ABS for the machine mods or PLA depending on where used?

I made all of the parts, also the extruder mod, out of PLA.
There is no need to use ABS for the extruder parts, as the E3D doesn’t get even warm on the mounting side under normal operation.

[quote]I have looked at the vertex in passing and think it’s a pretty cool machine. But with this machine, I feel as it is really truly “limitless” to the upgrades that can be done!
[/quote]
That’s exactly why i bought it in the first place.

[quote]I have been playing with a 0.8mm nozzle on the std. e3dV6 - got a couple successful prints but for prints that start with a couple “islands” say, corners off the bed, part way up start to curl up. From there I encounter the nozzle hitting after single layer height increase (unless it starts where it just finished, but will still slam into the next “island”.
- I’m still sticking with simplify3d as I feel comfortable with it now and like the custom options with the supports, etc.
- Do you know of what may be causing my warped up corners? I am thinking I need to bring the outlines to single and only one bottom layer.
- I feel as if someone told me that there is a way to raise then lower back when going to the next point so it doesn’t lose x / y location.
- Let me know how you handle such prints in general, where it’s not a bed adhesion issue but warping “curling up” on the say 4th layer.

I greatly appreciate all of your help and answers with your experience behind them! Look forward to hearing from you and hopefully helping others who read these posts along the way :-)[/quote]

I’m not sure what exactly you mean.
Can you post som pictures of such a problematic print? That will help to identify the problem.
Generally high infill causes warping, as well as high temperature differences between printed part and ambient air.
Most it helps (at least for me) to cool the part (fan) from the 2.nd layer up. Using brim is also a good idea on such parts.

Always a pleasure to give back to the community that got me started.

cheers,

Christian

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”][quote=“Meximelt”]
OK - So I’m confident on the relay…when it finally shows up from the UK.
- Regarding the frequency of switching, I only had it working for a day or so before it killed my relay contacts. I feel as if it was more on the 5-10 sec between on/off’s but will have to see once I get that going again
- did you have a socket for your relay for the heatbed or directly solder to the contacts?
[/quote]

I just soldered the relay and the components on a small piece of striped perf-board and made a small case for it.

Can it be it’s not the contacs that are gon on your relay, but the coil?
Did you use a proper current limiting resistor and a flyback diode when you connected the coil?

[quote=“Meximelt”]
[color=#0000FF]Nice, that works well!
I wasn’t getting the resistor to drop full from the 15V to 12V. So at one point, I still ran it at lower voltage just to test. Maybe I burned out the contacts mostly there. Also, I dropped using 2 resistors in parallel and it was only dropping to like 14V… Then end result was a contactor problem I assumed, which may have been caused by incorrect voltage. I’m not sure why my calcs to figure what resistor to use didn’t work using your example, but I’ll at least have spec sheet to figure that out now.

I did indeed setup like you with the flyback diode. I’ll double check my polarity on that too.[/color]

Your “hanging mod” is really cool and I’d love to try that → Hanging Z axis mount for Velleman K8200/3drag with velleman K8204 Trapezoid leadscrew upgrade by Ichbinsnur - Thingiverse
- Do you print all of your parts in ABS for the machine mods or PLA depending on where used?

I made all of the parts, also the extruder mod, out of PLA.
There is no need to use ABS for the extruder parts, as the E3D doesn’t get even warm on the mounting side under normal operation.[/quote]

@Meximelt

[color=#0000FF]I thought that they looked like PLA and nothing too crazy! So my real issue still lies in bed adhesion. I’ve gone from the Blue Tape to the hairspray on the glass and went back to the tape for some reason.[/color][/quote]

[quote]I have looked at the vertex in passing and think it’s a pretty cool machine. But with this machine, I feel as it is really truly “limitless” to the upgrades that can be done!

That’s exactly why i bought it in the first place.

[quote]I have been playing with a 0.8mm nozzle on the std. e3dV6 - got a couple successful prints but for prints that start with a couple “islands” say, corners off the bed, part way up start to curl up. From there I encounter the nozzle hitting after single layer height increase (unless it starts where it just finished, but will still slam into the next “island”.
- I’m still sticking with simplify3d as I feel comfortable with it now and like the custom options with the supports, etc.
- Do you know of what may be causing my warped up corners? I am thinking I need to bring the outlines to single and only one bottom layer.
- I feel as if someone told me that there is a way to raise then lower back when going to the next point so it doesn’t lose x / y location.
- Let me know how you handle such prints in general, where it’s not a bed adhesion issue but warping “curling up” on the say 4th layer.

I greatly appreciate all of your help and answers with your experience behind them! Look forward to hearing from you and hopefully helping others who read these posts along the way :-)[/quote]

I’m not sure what exactly you mean.
Can you post som pictures of such a problematic print? That will help to identify the problem.
Generally high infill causes warping, as well as high temperature differences between printed part and ambient air.
Most it helps (at least for me) to cool the part (fan) from the 2.nd layer up. Using brim is also a good idea on such parts.

Always a pleasure to give back to the community that got me started.

cheers,

Christian[/quote]

[quote=“Meximelt”][color=#0000FF]Sure, images can be seen here dropbox.com/sh/4k1z1fbbajho … _L2ma?dl=0

• The one in white was printed 0.4mm nozzle probably at like 50% infill
• The one in green was printed 0.8mm nozzle @ 25% infill with total print speed reduced to about 1/3 around 2000. The infill couldn’t keep up (stay where it was extruded and pulled around by the nozzle as you can see them all over the place until higher layers. Layer height 0.4mm and width same.

Man did I butcher this reply / quotes I made all of my last replies in blue to help you see, sorry!!! [/color][/quote]

[ichbinsnur]

Hi.
Had a look at your parts.

My first larger parts came out quite like yours.

What i found is, that cooling (and somtimes also printing with 10mm brim, especially on ABS) almost every time solved the problem.
I have found a nice cooling nozzle design that encloses the E3D heater block quight tight and blows the air underneath it.
With that nozzle and cooling at 100% from the 2.nd layer on i get almost no warping.

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”]Hi.
Had a look at your parts.

My first larger parts came out quite like yours.

What i found is, that cooling (and somtimes also printing with 10mm brim, especially on ABS) almost every time solved the problem.
I have found a nice cooling nozzle design that encloses the E3D heater block quight tight and blows the air underneath it.
With that nozzle and cooling at 100% from the 2.nd layer on i get almost no warping.

[/quote]

Hello - OK, I thought I was cooling well enough, had a nozzle type prior but didn’t realize the importance I guess. I do have it set for cooling 100% layer 2 on. I’ll look for one like yours on thingiverse.

Also, your recommendation to use the 10mm brim is something I’ll try, can’t hurt!

Thanks again for your help.

[pkhamre]

@ichbinsnur

I have found a nice cooling nozzle design that encloses the E3D heater block quight tight and blows the air underneath it.
With that nozzle and cooling at 100% from the 2.nd layer on i get almost no warping.

Do you have the STLs for those two parts?

[ichbinsnur]

[quote=“pkhamre”][quote=“ichbinsnur”]
I have found a nice cooling nozzle design that encloses the E3D heater block quight tight and blows the air underneath it.
With that nozzle and cooling at 100% from the 2.nd layer on i get almost no warping.
[/quote]

Do you have the STLs for those two parts?[/quote]

Yes, it’s a meshup of 2 different parts.
I post a link to them later or pot the parts on thigiverse.

[ichbinsnur]

Here is the link. Have fun!

thingiverse.com/thing:1022249

[pkhamre]

Thanks! Printing it right now with 3 hours 30 minutes left. Got my K8200 + E3Dv6 up and running with quite precise prints right now. Mounted a new Z-motor holder yesterday.

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”]Here is the link. Have fun!

thingiverse.com/thing:1022249[/quote]

Yes, also thanks for the parts! I was barely able to print the bracket (w/90 deg angle) and fan duct without it lifting from the bed. So I went further and had to bring down the infill on one and for the nozzle use 25!!! brims

Now, hopefully I can get a print going w/o so much hassle, then print the ninjaflex part and start finally playing around!

[Meximelt]

Hi - something I found you all may like…

I hate the z axis screw stop. I already had something in place but it wasn’t working great. My new one will be adjusted with this rod/anti backlash nut

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/k91a63joawda45y/AACQaWhb4tGsPA4SAgAl5Fdma?dl=0

[Meximelt]

[quote=“Meximelt”]Hi - something I found you all may like…

I hate the z axis screw stop. I already had something in place but it wasn’t working great. My new one will be adjusted with this rod/anti backlash nut

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/k91a63joawda45y/AACQaWhb4tGsPA4SAgAl5Fdma?dl=0[/quote]

Oh and if this helps any!

Paid 16.18 USD

Here’s what I bought exactly: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00I5UYB98?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00

Miniature Quality CNC 150 mm X M6 Stainless Steel Lead Screw & Anti-backlash Delrin Nut Block - 1 Set

Polished 150 mm x M6 stainless steel leadscrew
M6 1 mm pitch anti-backlash delrin nut block
No lubrication neccessary - will not corrode
Nut dimensions 32 mm x 23 mm x 13 mm
Convenient mounting with 2 hole fixing

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”]Here is the link. Have fun!

thingiverse.com/thing:1022249[/quote]

Your fan mod worked way better! Thank you so much!

Got part 1 of the “ninjaflex compatible” extruder / e3d v6 hot end mount printed from your design - and really worked well.
I bought ninjaflex semiflex sapphire 3mm 3DSF021290 and attempted to print when I had a rigged together extruder/mods a couple months ago. It printed really crazy - all was like falling into itself / vs printing layer by layer. It was on the infill moreso than any perimeters

• I spoke with them at the NinjaFlex producer and they said to increase the layer duration (or purge). Do you happen to know what those translate to in simplify3d??? Do you have any other suggestions for printing Ninjaflex?
• Also, do you know in simplify3d how to make it lift and back down if printing say multiple items on the bed? I have had some experiences where even in the same part, it went from say Robot arm left to torso to arm right and skipped on the x/y because it was moving along and “hit” the next high point.
• For this material, they suggested using 220c start, and if still having issues drop to like 217 or 218c (just fyi if it helps anybody)
• Now, I’m curious what is worth printing in Ninjaflex besides replacement feet for household items Or cell phone cases

[ichbinsnur]

Nice to hear you fund it useful.

Unfortunately i have no experience with simplify 3D.
But gererally ninjaflex prints best at low speeds, with big nozzle sizes and a bit higher temp.

[Meximelt]

[quote=“ichbinsnur”]Nice to hear you fund it useful.

Unfortunately i have no experience with simplify 3D.
But gererally ninjaflex prints best at low speeds, with big nozzle sizes and a bit higher temp.[/quote]

OK, I’ll be sure to follow that. Hopefully almost ready to wire in new 24V bed relay just received and ordered a custom hobbed bolt from ebay person - since the e3d one is way too short.
Taking it all one step at a time!

[Meximelt]

[quote=“Meximelt”][quote=“ichbinsnur”]Nice to hear you fund it useful.

Unfortunately i have no experience with simplify 3D.
But gererally ninjaflex prints best at low speeds, with big nozzle sizes and a bit higher temp.[/quote]

OK, I’ll be sure to follow that. Hopefully almost ready to wire in new 24V bed relay just received and ordered a custom hobbed bolt from ebay person - since the e3d one is way too short.
Taking it all one step at a time![/quote]

Hello,
OK again thanks for all of the help

• 24V bed / relay setup working (amazing heat up time now!)
• used your e3d v6 ninjaflex/mount in the extruder
• upgraded the z-axis rod/firmware
• regular prints looking very good (still playing with settings in simplify3d)
• Testing ninjaflex (semiflex now on 10mm cube - much better results)

to do… I am going to connect the e3d “hobbed goblin” to another m8 to make long enough to work with the stock extruder width. Feeding much better with my “dremel” sharpened stock hobbed bolt. Found it full of a lot of pla dust so hoping their “special machined” works with a good balance of drive and not cutting on way in.

You mentioned larger nozzles work better with the ninjaflex. I just finished 10mm test cube. Sides really nice. 50% infill w/.25 height looks better than the .20 ever did with stock z-axis rod. 0 retraction. Top “solid” layers 5. would have had to be like 8 to fill gaps.

What nozzle size do you like for it? Thanks!

[peter_the_steam]

Hi There
I have added a Hobb Goblin to my extruder head and found it to be wonderful. No Jamming!!!
If you have access to a lathe, then you can put a nyloc nut in the chuck and thin it down by about 2mm. If you then do not use any of the washers that come with the kit, it will fit.

Alternatively you can print a nut from PLA with a smooth bore of about 7.9mm. This nut can then be force threaded onto the outer end of the Hobb Goblin. You will find that if you get the hobbing central to the feed hole, the hob tends to stay in the right position anyway.

The teeth of the hobbing do not cut into the filament quite the same as the old bolt, but it feeds WAY better.

Another trick I did is to put the filament holder on the LEFT side of the printer. If you manually feed some filament through the hob, then back out again, you will find that the hobbing forces the filament into an even greater curve than normal. The resulting teeth marks on the filament are then on the outside of the curve, and they will rub in the guide. If you try the same thing with the filament on the left, you will find that the filament straightens out rather than curving more. This makes it a lot smoother to feed through the guides.

Cheers
Peter