Hi,
I tested d-c-fix® velvet as build surface.
Works very good and it is cheap.
Interesting. What’s the surface finish like where it touches the bed?
Quite normal. It has only a very thin layer (maybe o,o1mm) of velvet fibre on it but it is not bad from my opinion. It’s the best material I have tested so far. Actually it hasn’t failed once yet.
And I have tested: plain glass, sand blasted glass, blue tape, spray paint on glass, spray varnish on glass, contact plastic and some others…
I have ordered me a plate of PRINTinZ™ Flexible Printer Plate!
link: printinz.com/
I will let you all know how it all works out…
That looks interesting in one respect particularly - you can sand it down to get a perfectly level bed. At the moment, the Vertex rods sag a little to mean that the centre of the plate is closer to the nozzles than the far corners. If you can sand one of these sheets evenly in the centre, you could in theory compensate for this…
I don’t know if the rods sag. I think it might be the 4mm glass that is a bit higher on the middle due to the bending of the aluminium plate below. The aluminium plate possibly bends up a bit in the middle cause the height adjust attachments are not pointing exactly directly upwards. I’m not sure about this but this is my impression of the plate bending.
I don’t think so. I check by padding mine at the corners. I then slipped a feeler gauge between the glass plate and the aluminium bed. The glass plate was raised evenly, and the nozzles were still closer to the print bed at the centre of the bed than at the four corners. I’ve tried many things trying to sort this out, and I’m now convinced the rods are too small in diameter and sag under the weight of the head. I don’t see why they didn’t choose really robust diameters, like 12mm, which would guarantee no deflection.
Perhaps somebody with a laser lever could check if the axis is sagging or not.
My glass plate was bulging in the center (with a ruler set on top of it I had a difference of almost 1/2 mm between corners and center!).
I thought the aluminum plate was not flat but it’s not the case. I’ve checked it when I installed my heated bed. I took the whole thing apart and put the bed on a marble stone : perfectly flat! Now I’ve fitted it with springs and with the heated bed on top the surface is flat.
[quote=“biscuitlad”] I don’t see why they didn’t choose really robust diameters, like 12mm,[/quote]Perhaps to save weight?
It’s not really possible for the rods to sag… I challenge you to bend one 
Even with a sturdy vise an a lot of force I was not able to bend an 8mm rod even the slightest bit. Can you check the alu buildplatfrom plate again?
Well I have to disagree for unless I have done my calculations incorrectly then assuming the print head assembly weighs 300gms the deflection one would predict from a single centre loaded 8mm round steel beam with rigid supports and a span of 26mm would be 0.029mm.
Now the situation is more complex because there are two cross beams and these in turn are supported by two more beams but my point is that it is incorrect to state that there will be no deflection. This deflection may be very small but it will make the task of setting the print head height more challenging and it compounds the difficulties of matching the heights of dual heads. None of this is meant as a criticism of the machine which I think is excellent value and it is inveitable that other printers will also be subject to the same issue.
I don’t think its the aluminium build plate. As I said, I padded mine at the corners and still have the problem of the nozzles being closer at the centre than at the edge. Something that was confirmed when I slipped a feeler gauge between the build plate and the glass. There was even gap everywhere, therefore the problem is with either the glass, the buildtak or the rods sagging. If it’s not the last two, then how can you explain the glass being raised in the centre?
Whatever it is, there’s a definite problem that needs addressing.
You will NEVER get a 100% flat bed, or a 100% level movement.
For this you will have to compensate with very good adhesion.
I tried lots and lots of things. PVA glue mix was my best result until now, but a lot of hassle. Blue painters tape is fine for small stuff.
What i found as best result:
Heated bed at 70 (mandatory)
Cleaned Buildtack plate, sprayed with 3DLAC
Works every time, did not have 1 issue with warping anymore.
I don’t even have to squish my first layer as hard as before.
To free the part from the plate, i let it cool down, put it in the frig ;-), then i pry it of using a cutter knif, with someting under so i don’t damage the buildtack.
I redid my calculations and modified the assumptions. I think I had overestimated the weight of the print head assembly so I reduced it to 240gms. I assumed that this load was evenly split across the two cross bars. This gave a deflection of 0.0107mm. I then looked at the loading on the two carriage rods. I assumed that the loading on these was half the print head plus one of the steel print head rods which I calculated would weigh 110gms. The deflection on the carriage rod was calculated to be 0.0156mm, given a total deflection of 0.0263mm.
If this is correct then if one is looking to achieve a maximum of 0.03mm gap between the nozzle and the bed then the best strategy would be to ensure that the bed is level with the bars and then set the nozzle height in the centre 0.004. That way it will make it more likely that one will not suffer from curling edges on larger prints.
It is also interesting to note that if the diameter of the rods was increased from 8mm to 10 mm then this total deflection would fall to 0.0108mm.
I ought to add a caveat, I am new to 3d printing and I am not a mechanical engineer so the above may be complete fantasy
I understand several people ordered the PRINTinZ build plate. Has anybody already tried it? Any good? Any review available?
thanks
Still waiting for delivery…
I hope it is soon as my buildtak is wearing out and starting to fail on me
i agree on the sagging. the rods are more than strong enough to hold the weight and movement of the extruder (at least, single head is what i’m using:)) anyway, i had a problem yesterday with bent rods and because everything is closed because of Easter, i also took em to a vice and bent em back lol. worked pretty well (luckily of course, but i was desperate with all this free time and printer malfunctioning) it runs like a clock now:) The bending of the rods originates with me accidentically mounting the z-axis arm which carries the bed upside down. so when i auto-homed it for the first time, the bed went and hit the nozzle. have had shifting prints over last week a couple of times and when i disconnected the belts i found it no wonder. the rear 10mm and upper 8mm rods were bent so in the back it was hardly movable even by hand (and i have some big hands :P) The way it runs now is beautiful, but i don’t think i can do it again. Just out of curiosity, i’m an engineer, and see a lot of steel sorts etc. It is my ipmression the rods are made of C45 (because of the cautions for them to corrode when handled with bare hands etc and because it would be an obvious choice…) am i right?
Please update us about your PRINTinZ experience.
In the mean time I have designed a space to make sure the PRINTinZ flexible build plate can be firmly installed on the Vertex build construction.
I would appreciate it if you could print them and install it when you received your PRINTinZ build plate.
Based on your findings I can update the spacer when and if necessary so as all of us that decide to use this build plate can benefit from this effort.
Does that sound acceptable?
The spacer can be found here:- thingiverse.com/thing:758308
Thank you!
I’m afraid to say that the d-c-fix® velour surface has been absolutely the best for printing. In comparison I just tested a brand new buldtak but again it didn’t hold the piece corners on the surface.
D-c-fix® has not failed once!..for me this is absolutely the best printing surface…and it is cheap
What about if you print much larger objects that touch the printbed much more?
The BuildTak is just fine for sticking objects to it but in case of large objects you just cannot easily remove the objects. Sometimes it just damages the BuildTak. It sticks just too much and experimenting with the nozzle distance does not always help. I have printed a lot of object and already damaged 3 BuildTak sheets therefore I’m looking for an easy solution without having to fiddle with tape, glue, BuildTak and other material to glue on the glass plate. PRINTinZ seems to be that solution.
I just want to see some reviews before I order it!
Well, the PRINTinZ board came in and it was exact on the size as requested. It replaces my glass bed with buildtak for sure…
I did my first print on it and I am over the moon of this board… Why didn’t we have this a long time ago…
Printed me a small piece with sharp corders (double calibration piece) but it stuck… After taking out the board, I tried to pull the part of with my fingers but no way it came of…
But with the slightest bend you could hear it crack of … Came of perfectly clean and with a shiny bottom side!!
here it is installed … Clipped to the hotbed
For me it is sure… No more messing around with Blue tape, Kapton, Gluestick or any juice and no more BuildTak, this was starting to wear out and loosing grip on sharp corners…
So if you are looking for an alternative, this is one to, at least, consider… (shameless plug http://printinz.com/)
For the vertex I have them cut a plate with size 214 x 238, but re-measure your base plate!!!.. as this is not a standard size they have they will send you a paypal payment request …
excluding shipping it costs me $57 (+$20 for outside US) but in my opinion it is money well spent!!