We have a VM8400MB board with a Velleman K8400 3D printer. Now we want to increase the heating temperature up to 400 degree centigrade. We are wondering if the VM8400MB board would be damaged by increasing the nozzle heating temperature with corresponding firmware modification.
I don’t think the MB or the power supply can handle 400C.
The hot end will also be damaged.
Just wondering what do you plan on printing with?
[quote=“Wrong Way”]I don’t think the MB or the power supply can handle 400C.
The hot end will also be damaged.
Just wondering what do you plan on printing with?[/quote]
Thanks for your relying. We plan to print PEEK, the melting point is around 350C. Can the MB and power supply handle around 380C?
I’m not positive but I don’t think the heating element power supply or control board can achieve this.
If it does you will surely destroy the print head.
If you look in the spec the K8400 was designed for PLA or ABS
Print technology: Fused Filament Fabrication (FFF)
Layer resolution: standard: 0.1 mm (maximum: 0.2 mm - minimum: 0.05 mm)
Build plate: 215 x 240 mm (8.46" x 9.45")
Build volume: 180 x 200 x 190 mm (7" x 7.8" x 7.5")
Print speed: 30 mm/s - 120 mm/s
Travel speed: 30 mm/s - 300 mm/s
build plate surface: Removable layer of BuildTak™ (consumable; also sold separately).
filament diameter: 1.75 mm (accepts all filament spools with a mounting hole = 53 mm). Open filament policy.
[color=#FF0000] prints: PLA, ABS[/color]. Testing with other materials in progress.
nozzle 1&2 diameter: 0.35mm. One nozzle supplied. Second nozzle optional.
Distance between nozzles: 23.7 mm
Maximum nozzle operating temperature: 270 °C
[quote=“Wrong Way”]I’m not positive but I don’t think the heating element power supply or control board can achieve this.
If it does you will surely destroy the print head.
If you look in the spec the K8400 was designed for PLA or ABS
[/quote]
I fully agree.
If you want to print such high temp material you would have to switch for an all metal Hotend and a sufficient power supply.
We are using PEEK for the hotend so printing with PEEK isn’t possible or you’ll destroy the hotend as said earlier.
You’ll need a full metal hotend.
We don’t sell a full metal hotend for the Vertex, but people here on the forum did develop something for it.
You’ll have to search on the forum.
Or on thingiverse.
thingiverse.com/search?q=k8400+e3d&sa=
Remark! We don’t officially support these modifications! [size=50](but we love them)[/size]
[quote=“VEL337”]We are using PEEK for the hotend so printing with PEEK isn’t possible or you’ll destroy the hotend as said earlier.
You’ll need a full metal hotend.
We don’t sell a full metal hotend for the Vertex, but people here on the forum did develop something for it.
You’ll have to search on the forum.
Or on thingiverse.
thingiverse.com/search?q=k8400+e3d&sa=
Remark! We don’t officially support these modifications! [size=50](but we love them)[/size][/quote]
Thanks for your replying. We are planning to change the hotend in any case. The thing we are concerning at this moment is if increasing temperature into that high would damage the MB…
Just some thoughts on top of the already given comments:
1: power consumption
Since you plan to print PEEK the print temperature must be up to 400°C. Actually the heating power is sufficient to melt PEEK (which means is capable of damaging the PEEK isolator) in steady state, which means without pushing filament. Since you would like to print PEEK you have to heat up the material too, so you need some additional power to provide the melting heat. So as a rule of thumb I suggest you need twice the heating power which is actually installed. This may become marginal for the original hareware, but seems to be handable.
The main problem in my opinion is the additional heat flow through the hotend. The PEEK is acting as a thermal isolator !!! against the rest of the hotend. Therefor the K8400 can work with quite moderate heating power. By maintaining this concept you may need a polymer with higher operating temperature than PEEK (like PBI or some compounds) but with similar or better thermal resistance.
If you are planning in a pure metal hotend following the E3D philosophy, where most of the generated heat has to be drained (by fans), so you has to increase the necessary heating power ( minimum four times!), which will run the power supply and probably the connectors to their limits or above.
So your final hotend design will decide if you can use the original hardware.
2: temperature sensing
Think about the way you would like to measure the temperature. There are several critical aspects:
- The used temperature sensors (all glass encapsulated sensors) are specified for a temperature range up to 250°C / 280°C, depending on supplier. No characteristis are normally given for such a device for higher temperatures. So you have to take a temperature / resistance reference curve by yourself, not knowing the degradation effects coming from the thermal overstress at 350° C operating temperature.
- The thermal link between hotend and temperature sensor is very poor for the original K8400 design. You have to take care about good thermal contact. Take care of thermal filler, the majority of them are normally specified up to 150°C !!!
- Temperature sensors capable for such high temperatures are special kind of Pt - thermistors. Unfortunately the temperature sensing becomes very poor using a PT100 or even a PT1000 as replacement for the NTC. So you need an interface board which is amplifying the temperature signal to be used with the K8400 hardware. This reference curve needs to be implemented in the firmware.
It would be nice to get some thoughts upon your design, since I’m personally looking for and trying some improvements of the hotend design.
[quote=“VEL337”]We are using PEEK for the hotend so printing with PEEK isn’t possible or you’ll destroy the hotend as said earlier.
You’ll need a full metal hotend.
We don’t sell a full metal hotend for the Vertex, but people here on the forum did develop something for it.
You’ll have to search on the forum.
Or on thingiverse.
thingiverse.com/search?q=k8400+e3d&sa=
Remark! We don’t officially support these modifications! [size=50](but we love them)[/size][/quote]
Hello, as supporter, do you have the data that the current carrying capabilities of the board?